Where has the "Spam Settings" Tab gone?

Spotter asked a question...

Hi @ all,

I was wondering where the Tab for the Spam Settings in "user.riseup.net" has gone?
as qouted here (https://riseup.net/en/spam):
Customize your spam settings:
Visit account.riseup.net and login.
Click on Email and then Spam settings.
Click enable statistical filter

My Problem is: There is an active Spam-Filter in my account and it's sorting mails into the spam-folder. These mails are sent via riseup-list. That's why i want to deactivate it.

Thanks in advance.
spotter

Upvote | 13
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hello,

We did not include the spam settings in the new system. We can add back spam settings, but it was just lower priority than everything else, so didn't make the cut this time.

There should not be mails that are put into your spam folder from a riseup list. Can you provide me a copy of the full message with the headers so I can look at the problem? If you can get the *full headers* and copy them and paste them into https://share.riseup.net (click new paste), then save it and send me the URL, I will look into it.

Upvote | 0
Spotter replied...

here it is.: https://share.riseup.net/#bxg8WIidkV60VJS0_An5Gg
2 mails actually. 1st is from a list.riseup.net
2nd is from an webshop which was never a problem before...
(the list names are crossed out, hope thats not a problem)

Upvote | 1
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Thanks for pasting those, super helpful!

Ok, lets look at each one:

1. the lists.riseup.net one: we actually did properly "shortcircuit" our spam system on that one, you can see at the top this:

X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.0 required=6.0 tests=SHORTCIRCUIT,
USER_IN_WHITELIST shortcircuit=ham autolearn=disabled version=3.4.0

That means this message was given a *minus* 100 score, you need a 6 to consider it spam. It was shortcircuited as 'ham' which is good.

So why did it go to Spam? I am pretty sure its because the subject:

Subject: Re: [kellerag] ***SPAM*** Anti-Flag (!!!)

Our system looked at that and thought that it was spam, and put it in the spam folder. Not sure why that subject is there, but people replying with that in the subject are going to continue to cause that to happen. So try to remove that from the subject!

2. the second one -- this one got classified as spam because it got a score of 7.2 (required=6.0), the BIG reason why it got that high was because of this check: "5.0 KAM_FAKE_DELIVER Fake delivery notifications" - that one fires if the content of the email has some typical text that is related to delivery of a package, but meets certain spam criteria. There are some *very* common fake package delivery spam emails that exist out there and it seems like this message (with the body of the mail, which was not included), has some of those phrases. We could either try and whitelist the blackmosquito site, or we could look at the contents of the message and see what happened there and see if we can tweak our rules some more.

Upvote | 0
Spotter replied...

so here's the body from the black mosquito mail. i tried to anonymize my data, would be nice if you delete the paste after looking into it. https://share.riseup.net/#QIDL-3jdqxRaemDHWlWD3A

and thanks for the tip with the subject. sometimes it can be so easy to find a solution...

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hi, thanks for sending that along.

I've tweaked the spam rules to try and resolve that.

Is there any way for you to test it, for example by getting another similar message from the same place?

Upvote | 0
Cin replied...

So is there no longer a way to whitelist addresses? I have a lot of messages I want actually end up in my spam folder, and the solution before was to whitelist those addresses - now I can't find a way to do that. Any suggestions?

Upvote | 1
Medium
Crossbill replied...

At the moment, there is not a way to whitelist addresses. We may add this feature back, we were unsure how useful it was.

Upvote | 0
Liberman replied...

Well, your spam system never worked for me, giving a lot of false positives (like amazon.es important emails), but now I cannot disable it.
I don't get why disabling your filter is not a "useful" thing at all. The filter itself is not useful at all, and is what is getting most of my friends out of riseup.

Now if you don't allow to disable it (so we can configure it in our clients side), I suppose we will need to migrate to other services.

Thank you anyway.

Upvote | 2
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hello,

It isn't that we didn't think that the ability to disable spam filtering was useful or not, we thought it was useful and that is why we implemented it. However, we didn't know how many users found it useful, because we did not know how many people were using it. We usually found that people were not using it, and it caused confusion, so when we made the new system we didn't build that into the first version, but that doesn't mean that it wont be implemented, in fact your feedback is valuable for us to hear so we can prioritize that.

If you are getting false positives by the spam filter, then you can help train the filter by moving those false positives out of the Spam folder into your Inbox, it takes several of these adjustments for the filter to learn enough so it wont continue to classify similar messages as spam. If there is a particularly egregious problem, then file an issue with the detailed headers so we can investigate and improve the filter. As the original reporter here did.

Stay tuned for filtering options to come back...

Upvote | 3
Silvaticus replied...

I would STRONGLY recommend bringing back the Spam Settings and ability to whitelist addresses. I, along with a number of people I know, have been tearing our hair out over the past week because of all the LEGITIMATE emails winding up in the Spam folder.

Upvote | 3
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Thanks for the note Silvaticus, good to hear!

Its interesting to find out that people actually were using this capability before!

In the meantime, until we have this available, please train the filter by dragging any legitimate emails that end up in your spam folder into the inbox.

Upvote | 0
Being 461651 1920
Beaseed replied...

Spam settings must be brought back for the many reasons already stated. I STRONGLY recommend bringing back the Spam Settings and ability to white-list addresses. LEGITIMATE emails end up in the Spam folder. And, I want to disable your filter since it seems not to learn, even when I move legitimate but tagged emails to the INBOX. It seems easier to teach my client software to recognize spam messages rather than waiting for the Statistical filter to learn.

Upvote | 2
Cyanolyca turcosa ecua4944
Urraca De Cuello Negro replied...

Spam settings are back and up for testing. Please report any issues you find with them if possible https://account.riseup.net/mail_spam

Upvote | 1
Spotter replied...

Thanks for your work!

The next days will show in it's working, but i think it will!

Upvote | 0
Mcnair@Riseup.Net replied...

I found out from this thread that moving spam email out of my junk folder helps to train the spam system. Is this info given to users anywhere? Posted at the top of a email marked spam could be helpful.

Upvote | 0
Nick.Power replied...

@Crossbill: I have the same problem with my riseup list that it's wrong recognized as spam

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hi Nick,

I've been working on this problem, and I hope to have a solution for it soon. Thank you for mentioning the problem.

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Ok, I've implemented a solution that should help alleviate this problem!

Upvote | 0
Kardan
Kardan replied...

> I found out from this thread that moving spam email out of my junk folder helps to train the spam system. Is this info given to users anywhere? Posted at the top of a email marked spam could be helpful.
I remember this feature to be around for a while and looked it up: https://riseup.net/en/about-us/newsletter/2014/06#spam-dragging-you-down "If any legitimate mail gets put in your Spam folder, drag it over to your INBOX so our system can learn from its mistakes!"

It is however not documented in neither of
https://riseup.net/en/spam
https://riseup.net/en/email/settings/email-filters
https://riseup.net/en/email/scams

so I opened an issue to not forget about it:
https://github.com/riseupnet/riseup_help/issues/472

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Thanks Karden! You are right, it isn't well-documented and that could be improved!

I think I'll close this issue, and we can continue with the help issue to resolve it.

crossbill

Upvote | 1
Charles Ogg replied...

I would like the spam filter removed. I started getting so many political emails marked as spam it filled up my box so quickly it effectively disabled my email!

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hi Charles,

You can change the spam filter sensitivity by logging into https://account.riseup.net and clicking on your email settings.

crossbill

Upvote | 0
Just Another Archivist replied...

Hi crossbill,

Is there any way to disable the spam filter entirely? I've reduced the sensitivity to the minimum, but it's still classifying legitimate messages as spam. The whitelist unfortunately doesn't accept entries like * or *@*.

JAA

Upvote | 1
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hi JAA,

Unfortunately, we don't have a way to disable it entirely, but I'm happy to take a look at why you are getting so many legitimate messages classified as spam, that should *not* happen.

First of all, I'd need to know your account name, and then I'd need to have some samples of messages that are being flagged as spam, with the headers.

However, I would recommend that you first open a new support ticket for this information, as there are a number of other users that are connected to this one, and they will all receive the information you provide. If you make another support request, we can make sure it is private so your information will not be shared.

Upvote | 0
Pelle replied...

I'm getting a large amount of false positives too. It would be great to be able to disable the spam filtering on the Riseup mail. I'd like to quote Paul Graham here on this:

> False positives are innocent emails that get mistakenly identified as spams. For most users, missing legitimate email is an order of magnitude worse than receiving spam, so a filter that yields false positives is like an acne cure that carries a risk of death to the patient.

http://www.paulgraham.com/spam.html

Upvote | 0
Medium
Crossbill replied...

Hi Pelle,

As I said to JAA, if you would like to open a support issue and make it private, and provide some examples of the false positives you are getting, we can resolve those.

Upvote | 0